(Auckland, New Zealand, January 15, 2001, am)
Tridandisvami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja
Always try to honor all, even
those who are criticizing me. Don't care, because they
are all like my children. I have promised Srila Svami
Maharaja that I would help them.
Even if they will do like
this. [Srila Narayana Maharaja moved his arm as though he
were hitting himself] no harm. They can even pass stool
and urine on me; still, don't try to quarrel.
Brajanatha Prabhu: I heard
that someone recently said that the biggest mistake the
GBC made was to ban Srila Narayana Maharaja.
Srila Narayana Maharaja: Yes.
I told them, "This will the biggest problem for you.
Because of that I will have to travel here and there. No
one will be able to bind me. However, if you are on
friendly terms, then, oh, I will be like a lion
Dhrstadyumna Prabhu: Then you
will be under the control of the GBC.
Srila Narayana Maharaja: Yes,
they will be able to control by love and affection.
Without this no one will be able. Srila Svami Maharaja
controlled me so much by love and affection, and I am
still under his control. No one else can control me. Even
Krishna can never control me, because I am already under
the control of Srimati Radhika. Radhika is so powerful.
If Krishna will be angry upon me, I will say, "Why are
You angry? You should not be angry. My Svamini is
Radhika, you know." Then Krishna will say, "Oh, your
Svamini is Radhika. Then, namaskara to you."
Krishna Bhajana Prabhu:
Gurudeva, many devotees who we are speaking to think that
Gaudiya Matha and yourself are different from Srila
Srila Narayana Maharaja: If
they think that way, it means that they think Srila Svami
Maharaja was not following Srila Rupa Gosvami, Srila
Sanatana Gosvami, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, Sri Narada
Gosvami, Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Srila Prabhupada
Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati and all others like them.
Because I am in their line, I must be in the line of
Srila Svami Maharaja. No one has any right to say
otherwise. If my Gurudeva tells me, "Oh, you are my
transcendental disciple," and I am accepting that he is
my transcendental Guru, then even if the whole world is
not accepting this, what is the harm? There is no
Srila Bhaktivedanta Svami
Prabhupada has told me that, "Our relationship is
transcendental, and because of this you should give my
samadhi and help my devotees." And I am also accepting
him as my siksa-guru. Therefore, even if everyone in the
whole world does not accept this, it means they are
foolish. They are not obeying their Gurudeva. They are
outside of their Gurudeva's control, and they are
therefore guru-druhi [against one's guru]. Why are they
not accepting this?
So I am not disturbed.
Whether they are speaking favorably or unfavorably. I am
the same. My relationship with him is the same. I should
They have only been connected
with Srila Svami Maharaja for some days. I have been
connected for a long time-from 1946 up till now. Only by
his mercy I am going here and there-and so many are
Dhrstadyumna Prabhu: I was
recently with an old friend, and after we performed
gurupuja to Prabhupada's murti I said, "If Prabhupada was
physically present-we know that he is accepting out
pranamas, our kirtanas, our offerings of flowers, and we
are accepting that he is there-but for a moment if he was
now physically here in this temple and he saw me and
said, 'Oh, Dhrstadyumna, where have you come from?' If I
say, 'I am with Srila Narayana Maharaja,' what would
Prabhupada do? He would say, 'O my Narayana Maharaja, he
should immediately come to my temple.' Wouldn't he? He
had to admit, 'Yes.'"
Srila Narayana Maharaja:
Surely. If anyone is neglecting me there, then Srila
Svami Maharaja is not there. When he will hear, "Narayana
Maharaja is here," at once he will come or he will call
me. And he is also calling me there [Maharaja pointed
upwards, indicating Goloka Vrindavana].
Dhrstadyumna Prabhu: But you
can't go yet. Krishna called Prabhupada too soon. We were
still babies. We were not ready yet.
Srila Narayana Maharaja: This
is natural. If Krishna and Radhika are coming here from
Goloka Vrindavana to shower mercy, why will Prabhupada
not come to me? Anywhere he may be, he will definitely
come. I have this very strong faith. I have served him so
much. ISKCON leaders cannot serve him in this way.
Devotee: What is the
relationship between diksa and siksa, and what is
Srila Narayana Maharaja: The
word initiation actually has come from the word diksa. A
qualified, realized guru, who is detached from worldly
things-he is really guru. Because he has some
realization, he can give diksa. But diksa is not
completed in one day or one moment, as it is going on
nowadays. Diksa is a class, a course - a process. In one
day we cannot be BA, MA, or PHD. It will take some
time. There is a regular process.
In diksa there are two
syllables, di and ksa. Di means that process by which one
can attain divya-jnana. What is divya-jnana?
Transcendental knowledge. What is transcendental
knowledge? Realized knowledge of what is Krishna-tattva,
what is sakti-tattva, what is maya-tattva, what is
prema-tattva, and especially what is bhakti-tattva. By
knowing all these, a thick relation with Krishna will
Devotee: What is our
relationship with Krishna?
Srila Narayana Maharaja: This
lady is your wife? What is the proof? [devotees point to
their son] Okay, but if she leaves you for another, with
her child, then what is the proof? Is there any
Devotee: We have a
Srila Narayana Maharaja: As
she is your wife-you have accepted, she has accepted, and
your whole group is accepting this-similarly you will
realize a thick relationship with Krishna: "I am
Krishna's eternal servant." One will receive a very thick
transcendental relationship with Krishna by that process.
I am an eternal servant; but what kind of servant? Mother
Yasoda is a servant, Nanda Baba is a servant, Upananda is
a servant, Baladeva is a servant, Krishna's friends are
servants, all the gopis are servants, and Radhika is also
a servant of Krishna. Mother Yasoda is a servant, but in
what way? Mother. Krishna takes the foot-dust of Nanda
Baba and Yasoda. This is their service. As for Srimati
Radhika and all the gopis, they are most beloved. So any
relation will come, as friend, or father, or mother. You
will realize everything, and naturally attachment will
come. This is first thing-divya-jnana.
Then, second is ksa. As you
will enter this process, all kinds of unwanted things,
namely nama-aparadha, vaisnava-aparadha, attachment to
this world, intoxication and sense gratification, will
all truly go. This process is the real meaning of diksa.
If you have received diksa but no relationship, and all
your unwanted things are still in your heart, this is not
really diksa. Even if you have performed a fire sacrifice
or heard the mantras, there will be no effect. The real
process is to accept the shelter of those who can give
these powerful things. The process begins from sraddha
(faith) and comes to the mood of rati (bhava- bhakti).
You'll realize what is rati. You will always be thinking,
"Krishna-Radhika." At that time, even if you want to give
up such remembrance, you will not be able to. Guru gives
this-even if he has not given any mantra-and this is
called diksa. Srila Sukadeva Gosvami never gave any
mantra to Maharaja Pariksit. But what did Maharaja
Pariksit achieve? He received the service of the gopis,
and he became attached to that service. And what did he
tell to his mother? Do you know his mother? Uttara.
Maharaja Pariksit told her, "You are my mother, but now I
am dying, and at this last moment I am giving you this
instruction. Don't see Krishna as your father-in-law.
What should you think? He is your beloved, as He was the
beloved of the gopis. Krishna is also your beloved and He
is also my beloved. Always keep this in your mind." This
statement proves that Maharaja Pariksit was connected
with Krishna only through Sukadeva Gosvami. Therefore,
Sukadeva Gosvami is actually his diksa guru.
Sometimes the siksa-guru is
much higher than the diksa-guru. Much, much higher. Do
you know who was the diksa-guru of Srila Raghunatha dasa
Gosvami? Yadunandana Acarya. But Srila Rupa Gosvami and
Srila Svarupa Damodara were much more qualified than him.
Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami accepted them as
siksa-gurus, and therefore his siksa-gurus were more
powerful than his diksa-guru. He offers pranamas
(obeisances) to Yadunandana Acarya, but he is much more
obliged to Sri Svarupa Damodara, Sri Raya Ramananda, Sri
Rupa Gosvami, and Sri Sanatana Gosvami. What has he
prayed to Sanatana Gosvami? "Vairagya-yuga bhakti-rasam
prayatnair. I was unwilling to drink the nectar of
bhakti-rasa enriched with renunciation, but by his
causeless mercy Sri Sanatana Gosvami induced me to do
so." Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami has not prayed like
this to Yadunandana Acarya. And he has prayed still more
than this to Sri Rupa Gosvami: "Sri rupa manjari karacit
pada-padma. O golden girl! When you are lying on the lap
of the prince on Vraja with your feet on the lap of Rupa
Manjari, and she is massaging your feet. Will she, by the
corners of her eyes, give me her maha-prasada seva of
gently messaging Your feet? She will message one foot and
I will message the other." The prayers in his Vilapa
Kusmanjali are all in relation to Srila Rupa Gosvami.
You should try to hear all
these things and develop your Krishna consciousness. This
is the aim and object of life.
Suppose someone is abusing
your guru and says, "Your gurudeva is a bogus person. All
his siddhantas are bogus." What will you do? If anyone
says, "Your guru is a very bogus person. He does not know
anything, and he does this and that. He always takes
wine. Your gurudeva is always absorbed in sense
gratification and does not obey his gurudeva. He left his
gurudeva." What you will do? What you will do? You don't
know? Will you hear more and more? Will this add to your
bhakti? Or, should you cut all his arguments? You should
tell me. If you cannot tell, then you are not a real
disciple. You should cut all the arguments, and if
someone else is helping to cut all the arguments, you
should accept their words. Then I will be happy.